OK I know it's early, but....

Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

1 win, the first season. And hopefully winning 11 seasons in a row.

Once again, I fall on the "give it time" side. We are still hamstrung by lack of players. On this board it is okay when Miami drops 30% from normal (to 7-4 for example) because of lack of players (probation), but the same isn't supposed to happen here.

I believe that for 2003, 2004 and 2005 we are on the equivalent of probation and it is only fair to compare records accordingly.

My opinion is that 6-6 was really equal to 8-4 or 9-3 for us with a full boat of players. Since any year 8-4 or 9-3 would be considered a good to great year for us, I think we had a good year in 2003.

I believe 6-6 in 2004 would also be a good year considering.

But the question related to Gailey (it always does on this board by the bored 5) and in my opinion we could win one game and he'd be fine. Because the real and only fair way to measure his team is just not with wins right now.
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

Originally posted by GTCrew:
6-5 woud be the minimum. Less than that and there would have to be circumstances beyond Gailey's control. We are too good, and have too much talent (young or not), to accept less than 500.

8-3 would be impressive considering VT, Miami, UVA, UGA etc are on the schedule.
<font size="2" face="Arial, Verdana, Sans-Serif">Would have to agree w/ GT
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

In projecting wins and losses we have to factor in many variables. How will the coaching staff be comprised? Will Chan hire a real OC and give him the freedom to call the plays? Have the coaches developed young Reggie to the point that he will show some real progress? How many of his new recruits will be able to make meaningful contributions? I think this is key because we are so thin in so many positions. Of course the number of injuries we sustain and the academic status of our players is another vital concern.

Assuming that all the above questions can be answered in the affirmative we should be in a position to make some strides. The most glaring weakness that we had was our special teams which were not very special and the punting in particular.

It seems that Chan has a kicker that should allay our concerns about KO's and FG's which should improve our field position but I read recently a report on the lunch bunch speaker on the Hive that repeated what Chan had said earlier that we do not intend to sign a punter and we seem to be banking on a walk on and if this is the case we could be flirting with disaster. You can't afford 18 yard punts against the likes of V-Tech or Miami or any other decent program without paying the piper.

If we stabilize all the above factors I don't think that seven or eight wins are unrealistic, but if not it could turn sour and be a long season.

I think that this season will be crucial for Chan to show some real improvements if he is to retain the support that he enjoys today. I can accept even less wins and feel good about Chan if we play consistent FB and avoid this yoyo schizophrenic extremes that has seemed to plague his teams since his arrival.

None of us really know why the team performs as it does and if we had the advantage to have a talk with the coaches about it then we may be able to see and understand it better but all most of us know is what we see on the field and sometimes we come away with a bad feeling.
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

Finding a good punter will be critical. Not to knock Thomson because he's doing his best, but we need consistency in this department and poor punting can easily come back to bite us if we're not careful.

Maybe (and hopefully) there are some soccer players on campus with strong legs?
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

For me to be sold on Gailey as the right guy we have to win the Humanitarian Bowl and win at least 8 games next year. That is my opinion.

I think if we lose the bowl game and have another middling (mediocre) season next year, it will be time to move in another direction at Head Coach. They are plenty of guys out there that can go .500 for a lot less money.

Go Jackets!
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

Thanks for ALL the replies and this has been a good thread. One this board has been needing in recent weeks if you ask me...and I know you didn't.

While I tend to still think that 8 wins would get the bashers off of CCG's back and stabilize the program somewhat, I tend to agree with MidAtlantaTech on one thing...

Having lost 10 players from the program...we are STILL on probation. This is going to affect this team for the next two seasons...like it or not.

IF we can keep the injury bug away like we did this season (and that's a BIG IF) AND if we can keep the academic casualties away then we have a good shot at 7-8 wins the next two years (like we did this season), BUT those things HAVE to happen for us to be semi-successful and keep our bowl streak alive. Hopefully we'll get back a couple of players from flunkgate, but if we don't, remember...we're STILL on probation....again....LIKE IT OR NOT.
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

There are a lot of ifs, ands, or buts on the flats these days. If no more academic problems, or no more injuries, and we get a few more 4 star players. We are on academic probation, CCG has to be more consistant with the weak teams (Duke etc), no more blow, outs more competitive with the strong teams. I look for 6 to7 wins and possibly a new coach.
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

Originally posted by midatlantech:
1 win, the first season. And hopefully winning 11 seasons in a row.

Once again, I fall on the "give it time" side. We are still hamstrung by lack of players. On this board it is okay when Miami drops 30% from normal (to 7-4 for example) because of lack of players (probation), but the same isn't supposed to happen here.

I believe that for 2003, 2004 and 2005 we are on the equivalent of probation and it is only fair to compare records accordingly.

My opinion is that 6-6 was really equal to 8-4 or 9-3 for us with a full boat of players. Since any year 8-4 or 9-3 would be considered a good to great year for us, I think we had a good year in 2003.

I believe 6-6 in 2004 would also be a good year considering.

But the question related to Gailey (it always does on this board by the bored 5) and in my opinion we could win one game and he'd be fine. Because the real and only fair way to measure his team is just not with wins right now.
<font size="2" face="Arial, Verdana, Sans-Serif">I agree with midatlantic.

But i wouldn't be surprised to see a breakout 9 win season next year, and I expect one in 2005.
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

No less than 9 with a win over Ugag
drinking.gif
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

Originally posted by JacketFanPCB:
C'mon guys, please don't misdirect this thread with stuff about Donnan or anything else.

It's a simple question. HOW MANY WINS WOULD IT TAKE for Gailey to get the support from the fanbase at large that he needs to build a winner???

Simple question. Let's have a little fun.
<font size="2" face="Arial, Verdana, Sans-Serif">Jacket Fan PCB - I wasn't trying to misdirect your quote but perhaps adding a sub-question: will CCG survive a 3 game losing streak to our biggest rival,regardless of other w-l's. This was,IMHO, the biggest reason the coach mentioned above was removed from his job.

In answer to your question, 8 wins is the number for me to believe that we are moving forward under coach Gailey. This is due to 2 factors - A) good coaches,unless they are at schools with no tradition/history/resources (ref.Beamer at VT or Snyder at K.State), have immediate impact,even if the school where they take over was not winning prior to their arrival (ref.Tressel,Friedgen,Richt,the guy at Tulsa.Granted ,OSU and Ga.were winning but they went immediately to the next level with the new coaches with no time needed for "adjusting to the new system". Friedgen won an ACC championship his first year,IIRC,without "his players."). B)by his 3rd year, a large % of the roster should have been recruited by the incumbent coach and the learning curve,which some coaches have been able to overcome immediately, should be behind the program.

To summarize the above,IMHO,to many coaches have produced immediately, at worse programs than Tech,for me to give 100% credence to the old it takes 4-5 years to build a program myth.The exception would be if we were starting from the level of K.State,Duke,etc.

Having said that, I think Braine will give CCG the 4th year unless we have a 5 win or less season.

Somebody here said you can't judge a coach by his W-L reord, or WTTE. I want to work for that guy at my next job!
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Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

7 wins minimum is what I'm looking for. With our schedule that will be pretty tough, doing better will mean a really solid year all around.

I agree with AlaGold though, I still think what we miss the most is a big play WR. If you notice, most big play offenses and top QBs have the leeway to just throw the ball out there and rely on a WR to get it. In fact, I'd say as many long plays are on underthrown balls as well thrown ones. We just haven't seen that around here since Kelly left IMO.

Maybe Calvin Johnson is that guy, or one of our other receivers is ready to break out. But to me it's an attitude thing. You know, the determination that the ball is mine no matter where it's thrown. Haven't seen that this year from any of our receivers.

I'm not too worried about the defense. Sure we'll miss our LBs but the focus of the defense may change. We should be stronger up front and in the back and that will give the new LBs a chance to get their feet on the ground.

The other big deal obviously is continued growth at the QB position. Who said the best thing about Freshmen is they grow up to be sophomores?
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

Originally posted by ahsoisee:
It is way too early. We do not even know who we are playing yet. Personally, I will not even thing about it until the schedule comes out.

Father Time
<font size="2" face="Arial, Verdana, Sans-Serif">Very interesting. Have you changed your position since 12/2/03 when you posted the following on another board?

"My end of year promise To BeeBad!

I will not wait until after the bowl game. I fully expect almost any average team to get beat in Boise in January. About the only team that could beat those people in January would be a dominant team like Oklahoma, Michigan, or possibly FSU. If our players are not careful, there hands will freeze and break into pieces when the football hits their hands. It is too cold to play a game there for any team.

As far as I am concerned the season is theoretically over. It will be a major miracle if we win out there at that time of the year. If that is where Clemson lost last year, then I can understand why.

Yes, there is no doubt, Gailey should have another year. A first year of 7-6, and a second year of 6-7 or 7-6 is understandable under the present situation.

Gailey's first year was better than the big majority of first year coaches and tops at Tech in the history of first year coaches. His second year is a so-so season, but much better than predicted by the writers and sports analysts. Also, he doubled the expected wins in his second year over the expectations of his biggest detractors at Tech.

I remember Dave Tech making the statement on Stingtalk, "if Gailey wins five games, he will be here until he is 73, the same as Bowden at FSU.

Of course, there are many things that concern me, but next year will have to be a defining year one way or the other.

When Ralph left, we were no longer a superior team in the ACC. It was proven by a very disappointing season of 2001, when we were rated a top ten team. The program dropped to the point that the last coach had the same record, 7-6, in his last 13 games as the new coach in his first 13 games.

The proof of the pudding was also evident at Maryland, where Ralph has yet to go less than 9-3 in his three seasons there.

We had the biggest concentration of athletes in 2001 and could not produce as predicted with that team.

The next year, 2002, we entered the year with no established quarterback and an offensive coordinator who could not develop one of the three returning quarterbacks. We also had a depleted running back situation.

The new coach used a defensive back to start strong, but when he was injured in the fourth game, the season began to be a struggle. Also during the coach's first year, there was considerable resistance from some of his players to the new system employed.

With no established quarterback and a patched up running back position, the team limped home with the 7-6 record. With all of the first year problems facing the team, a 7-6 record was not that bad matched against the previous coach's same record.

I did expect a little better record this year, 2003, but with a freshman quarterback, and a big blow to the defensive line by flunkgate, the season was too erratic. However, it was not the disaster some predicted it to be. So, to be fair, the team exceeded the wins predicted.

In the year 2001, Tech had the best chance to succeed big time in recent history. We were loaded at most positions. We had Kelly, Burns, and Godsey, plus many other quality athletes. We had the best home field advantage to make it work. Most of the key games were in BDS. It is well known, we bombed.

In the first year of Gailey, we had lost a lot of key players to graduation, plus Gailey had to play those same key teams at their home field.

As mentioned, we were thin at running back and we had no experienced quarterback. Gailey still finished 7-6, playing many key games away from BDS.

This year was similar to O'Leary's last year, we had most of our key games at BDS. The two big killers this year were the BYU and Duke games away from BDS. We should not have lost these two games, but we did. However, we had four big upsets to offset these two downers. We were underdogs to Auburn, NCSU, Wake Forest, and Maryland, but Tech won these four.

I am disappointed in several areas of our game and expect some changes to be made after the recruiting season is over.

The biggest disappointment to me has been the lack of Tenuta to adapt to the short passing game from the opponents. This has been the biggest weakness in the whole team since he has arrived in 2002. I have my fingers and toes crossed that he will get a defensive coordinator's job in the pros after this season.

I am afraid Gailey will not take the necessary steps to fire Tenuta, so the only solution to this problem is if he gets his chance in the pros. I am hoping Gailey can use his pro influence to get Tenuta a job as OC on some pro team.

Since Gailey has always been connected with offenses, it would be ignorant of me to say he did not know how to run an offense.

I do think I am smart enough to see that any coach will fall short on other areas of his job, if he is too involved in one phase of the program.

I believe it is absolutely essential for a coach to pay close attention to all phases of the game, therefore, he should abandon his participation with the offense and promote Nix as the offensive coordinator.

This would free Gailey to see the deficiencies in the pass defense, in the special teams, on the offensive line, and the negligence of the assistants to substitute freely. I don't know if the offensive line coach needs to be replaced, but I do know we have had problems there this year.

At least, Gailey and Nix could be watching that area better if Gailey was not completely obsessed with the offensive strategy. Since Nix would be the offensive coordinator, he could also keep an eye on the performance of the offensive line.

Next year, I expect us to beat Connecticutt, Samford, Duke at home, and Wake Forest at home. There is no way we should lose any of those four games. If we lose any of those four, Gailey will be in deep doo-doo.

I think we should have a very good chance of beating Virginia at BDS, and North Carolina there. Those are six games we should have a great shot at winning.

The game at Auburn will be fierce, but with a year under his belt, Ball should be more dangerous and wiser. We should have an outside chance at winning.

North Carolina State will be without Rivers. We will have the experienced quarterback and more flexibility in the backfield. We should have at least an even chance of beating them there and maybe a little more than even.

Florida State will be playing us on our field. The odds are in our favor to win one at BDS. We definitely have a chance for an upset here.

The games at Maryland, Clemson, and UGA will be very tough games, but not out of the question.

We had better win Uconn, Samford, and Duke and Wake at BDS. We take Virginia at BDS, and NC there. That gives us six very winnable games.

We should win one of the three between Auburn, NCSU, and FSU at BDS.

We win one of the three against Maryland, Clemson, and UGA on the road.

We should win around eight games next year. Anything less than seven and/or a loss to one of the weak four and Gailey will be in a very tenuous position.

Father Time

Edited by: ahsoisee at: 12/2/03 9:24 am"

Now I recall that on 12/2/03 we did not know for sure who we were going to play in the HB, but we have known for a long time that we will not be playing Auburn in '04. And I believe that after the ACC meetings it was announced (around October 1st) that we would not be playing FSU or Wake in '04 but would have Miami and VT at home. While I admit that the next time we play Auburn RB will have more experience, I sure hope that he has more than one year of that additional experience.

I am also wondering about your position on Tenuta. Do you still want him to move on or be fired? From all that I have read on this board and other boards, and form all that I have heard CCG say, Tenuta did a wonderful job with an undermaned, but determined defense. I heard Wes Durham speak eariler this fall and he couldn't say enough good things about JT. With our low scoring offense, JT's defense saved our butts over and over again and kept us in every game (except Clemson) for as long as they could hold out. Yes, we had problems with short routes, but we performed well against the run and the deep routes. But even with our problems, could CCG's praise of JT have been disingenuous?

You have gone back in time to point out other posters' inconsistencies, espically when doing so promotes your point of view. I am simply following your example by bringing to your attention a previous statement which you made and asking you the following:

1. Do you still want JT fired or replaced as DC?
2. Do you believe that CCG was being less than candid with us this past season when he frequently and lavishly praised the job that JT has done for us?
3. Do you stand by your position that the 2003 season is over and we will lose in the cold weather in the HB?
4. Do you stand by your position that anything less than 7 wins or a loss to UCON, Samford or Duke will but CCG in a "tenuous position" or "deep doo-doo?"
5. Do you stand by your position that Nix should be the OC?
6. Do you know which teams we will be playing at home and away next year?
7. Did CCG show poor judgement this past year by choosing to function both as HC and OC?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Thanks for your response, and have a very nice Christmas.

PS: Clemson did not play in the HB last year.
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

Got to see the final schedule, but 5 or less wins could get him in trouble (based on other factors too, like more flunkgate which appears unlikely now). 6 wins again and he will get another round at the table at least. 7 or more wins will be considered a successful season.
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

I don't know the dates, but here is a list of our opponents for 2004:

Samford
UCONN
Miami
VT
UVA
Duke
@ Maryland
@ NC State
@ Clemson
@ UNC
@ UGA
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

Well if the opponents are as posted, we've only got one GIMME game and that is Samford. NO opponent after that will be easy. Duke will be as tough or tougher and don't forget UConn (coached by Randy Edsall) finished like 8-3 this past season.

With that schedule, 8 wins will be A HUGE accomplishment!
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

I agree also.

And to continue on a previous line,

I hope I never have to work for those of y'all that would find seven wins unacceptable in 2004.
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Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

Only 11 games next year? I'd be happy with a winning season with that schedule... the wins over NC State and Maryland will probably be tough to repeat on the road, barring any suprises. UNC looks like our only easy road game. Miami and VT have both been sliding though, so I think we'll take one of them at Bobby Dodd.
 
Re: OK I know it\'s early, but....

Originally posted by speedbump:
Only 11 games next year? I'd be happy with a winning season with that schedule...
<font size="2" face="Arial, Verdana, Sans-Serif">Not a flame at you, but the quote is indicative of the backsliding in our program. It wasn't that long ago when most of us Tech fans would look at that schedule and KNOW we would have a reasonable chance to win them all. Of course, we would have also known that, like playing FSU, beating Miami would have required us playing absolutely mistake-free football due to difference in athletes. During this same era we perhaps failed to win them all but were competitive at all times, never getting hammered to the tune of 39-3,51-7,41-17 (by Duke), etc.

From that we have been reduced to being happy with a winning season. That is why 8 wins is important to me, I want to see us back to the point where we can realistically expect to COMPETE with anybody on the schedule.

As I have said though, even though my expectations = 8 wins, I do believe Braine will give him another year if he manages a winning season.
 
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